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and unworkable. This too, good Kassapa, is a reason, by which reason it is thus for me: 'There is no other world, there are no spontaneously arisen beings, there is no fruit and result of good and bad deeds.' 'Well then, prince, I will make a simile for you. By a simile, some wise men understand the meaning of what is said. Just as, prince, a man might weigh a day-long heated iron ball, blazing, flaming, shining. Then at another time, he might weigh it cold and extinguished. When, pray, is that iron ball lighter, or softer, or more workable, when it is blazing, flaming, shining, or when it is cold and extinguished?' 'When, good Kassapa, that iron ball is accompanied by heat, and accompanied by air, blazing, flaming, shining, then it is lighter, and softer, and more workable. But when that iron ball is neither accompanied by heat nor accompanied by air, cold and extinguished, then it is heavier, and more rigid, and unworkable.' 'Even so, prince, when this body is accompanied by life, and accompanied by warmth, and accompanied by consciousness, then it is lighter, and softer, and more workable. But when this body is neither accompanied by life, nor accompanied by warmth, nor accompanied by consciousness, then it is heavier, and more rigid, and unworkable. By this reason too, prince, it should be thus for you: 'It there is another world, there are spontaneously arisen beings, there is the fruit and result of good and bad deeds.’” 425. “Although Master Kassapa says this, yet this is what occurs to me: ‘there is no other world, there are no spontaneously arisen beings, there is no fruit and result of good and bad deeds.’” “Is there, O Rājañña, a way…pe… There is, good Kassapa, a way…pe… How is that, O Rājañña?” “Here, good Kassapa, my men seize a criminal, and show him to me: ‘This, venerable sir, is a criminal; inflict upon him whatever punishment you wish.’ Then I say to them: ‘Well then, sirs, without harming the skin, the hide, the flesh, the sinews, the bones, the bone-marrow, deprive this man of life, so that we might see his life departing.’ They, assenting with ‘Yes, sir,’ deprive that man of life without harming the skin…pe… When he is dead, then I say to them: ‘Well then, sirs, lay this man face up, so that we might see his life departing.’ They lay that man face up. But we do not see his life departing. Then I say to them: ‘Well then, sirs, lay this man face down… lay him on his side… lay him on his second side… set him upright… set him head down… strike him with the hand… strike him with a clod… strike him with a stick… strike him with a weapon… shake him, toss him, winnow him, so that we might see his life departing.’ They shake that man, toss him, winnow him. But we do not see his life departing. His eye is still there, those forms are still there, but he does not perceive that sense-base. His ear is still there, those sounds are still there, but he does not perceive that sense-base. His nose is still there, those odors are still there, but he does not perceive that sense-base. His tongue is still there, those tastes , and he does not experience that base. That very body exists, those tangibles exist, and he does not experience that base. This too, good Kassapa, is a way, by which way it occurs to me— ‘thus there is no other world, there are no spontaneously reborn beings, there is no fruit and result of good and bad deeds.’” The Simile of the Conch-blower 426. “Then, Prince, I will make you a simile. By a simile some intelligent men understand the meaning of what is said. Formerly, Prince, a certain conch-blower took a conch and went to a border region. He approached a certain village; having approached, he stood in the middle of the village, blew the conch three times, put the conch on the ground, and sat down to one side. Then, Prince, it occurred to those people of the border region— ‘Oh, whose indeed is that sound, so delightful, so charming, so intoxicating, so captivating, so bewildering?’ They gathered together and said to that conch-blower— ‘Oh, whose indeed is that sound, so delightful, so charming, so intoxicating, so captivating, so bewildering?’ ‘This, good sirs, is called a conch, whose sound is so delightful, so charming, so intoxicating, so captivating, so bewildering.’ They laid that conch face up— ‘Speak, good conch, speak, good conch!’ But that conch made no sound. They laid that conch face down, laid it on its side, laid it on the other side, stood it upright, stood it upside down, struck it with their hands, struck it with a clod of earth, struck it with a stick, struck it with a knife, shook it, shook it vigorously, shook it thoroughly— ‘Speak, good conch, speak, good conch!’ But that conch made no sound. “Then, Prince, it occurred to that conch-blower— ‘How foolish are these people of the border region, These footless people, how indeed will they search for the sound of the conch in the wrong way? While they were watching, he took the conch, blew the conch three times, and taking the conch, he departed. Then, O king, to those people of the border regions this thought occurred: ‘Indeed, sirs, when this conch is accompanied by a person, and accompanied by effort, and accompanied by wind, then this conch makes a sound. But when this conch is not accompanied by a person, not accompanied by effort, not accompanied by wind, this conch does not make a sound.’ Just so, O king, when this body is accompanied by life, and accompanied by heat, and accompanied by consciousness, then it advances, it retreats, it stands, it sits, it lies down. With the eye it sees forms, with the ear it hears sounds, with the nose it smells odors, with the tongue it tastes flavors, with the body it touches tangibles, with the mind it discerns phenomena. But when this body is not accompanied by life, not accompanied by heat, not accompanied by consciousness, then it does not advance, it does not retreat, it does not stand, it does not sit, it does not lie down. With the eye it does not see forms, with the ear it does not hear sounds, with the nose it does not smell odors, with the tongue it does not taste flavors, with the body it does not touch tangibles, with the mind it does not discern phenomena. By this method too, O king, let it be thus for you: ‘There is indeed another world, there are spontaneously arisen beings, there is fruit and result of good and bad deeds.’ Although Venerable Kassapa says this, yet this is how it is for me: ‘There is indeed no other world, there are no spontaneously arisen beings, there is no fruit and result of good and bad deeds.’ ‘Is there, O king, a method… (etc.) There is, good Kassapa, a method… (etc.) How is that, O king?’ ‘Here for me, Friends, Kassapa, men seize a thief, a wrongdoer, and show him to me, saying: ‘This, venerable sir, is a thief, a wrongdoer. Inflict upon him whatever punishment you wish.’ Then I say to them: ‘Well then, friends, cut off this man’s skin. Perhaps we might see his life.’ They cut off that man’s skin. We do not see his life. Then I say to them: ‘Well then, friends, cut off this man’s hide, cut off his flesh, cut off his sinews, cut off his bones, cut off his bone-marrow. Perhaps we might see his life.’ They cut off that man’s bone-marrow. We do not see his life. This, too, friends, Kassapa, is a reason by which I come to think: ‘There is no other world, there are no spontaneously born beings, there is no fruit or result of good and bad deeds.’” The Parable of the Fire-Worshipping Ascetic 428. “Well then, chieftain, I will make a comparison for you. By a comparison, some discerning men understand the meaning of what is said. Once upon a time, chieftain, a certain fire-worshipping ascetic dwelt in a leaf-hut in a forest hermitage. Then, chieftain, a certain caravan arose in the countryside. Then that caravan stayed for one night near the hermitage of that fire-worshipping ascetic, and then departed. Then, chieftain, it occurred to that fire-worshipping ascetic: ‘What if I were to go to where that caravan was? Perhaps I might find some useful thing there.’ Then that fire-worshipping ascetic rose early and went to where that caravan was. Having gone, he saw in that caravan’s place a young boy, weak, lying on his back, abandoned. Having seen him, it occurred to him: ‘It is not proper for me that while I am watching, a human being he might die. What if I were to take this boy to the hermitage, and raise him, nourish him, bring him up? Then that fire-worshipping ascetic took that boy to the hermitage, and raised him, nourished him, brought him up. When that boy was about ten years old, or twelve years old, then some business arose for that fire-worshipping ascetic in the country. Then that fire-worshipping ascetic said to that boy: 'Son, I wish to go to the country; Son, you should tend the fire. Let not your fire go out. And if your fire should go out, here is an axe, these are sticks, this is a fire-drill set; generate fire and tend the fire.' Then that fire-worshipping ascetic, having thus instructed that boy, went to the country. While he was absorbed in play, the fire went out. Then it occurred to that boy: 'Father told me this: "Son, you should tend the fire. Let not your fire go out. And if your fire should go out, here is an axe, these are sticks, this is a fire-drill set; generate fire and tend the fire."' What if I were to generate fire and tend the fire? Then that boy carved the fire-drill set with the axe – 'Perhaps I might obtain fire.' But he did not obtain fire. He split the fire-drill set in two, split it in three, split it in four, split it in five, split it in ten, split it in a hundred (or twenty), he made it into splinters, having made it into splinters, he pounded it in a mortar, having pounded it in a mortar, he winnowed it in a strong wind – 'Perhaps I might obtain fire.' But he did not obtain fire.