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assailed me from all sides with a barrage of words, saying: ‘This venerable Potthapāda just approves whatever the ascetic Gotama says, He then approved of it thus: 'So it is, Blessed One! So it is, Fortunate One!' 'But we do not know of any categorical doctrine taught by the ascetic Gotama— whether 'the world is eternal,' or 'the world is not eternal,' or 'the world is finite,' or 'the world is infinite,' or 'the soul is the same as the body,' or 'the soul is one thing, the body another,' or 'the Tathāgata exists after death,' or 'the Tathāgata does not exist after death,' or 'the Tathāgata both exists and does not exist after death,' or 'the Tathāgata neither exists nor does not exist after death.' When I was told this, venerable sir, I said to those wanderers: 'Indeed, sirs, I also do not know of any categorical doctrine taught by the ascetic Gotama— whether 'the world is eternal,' or 'the world is not eternal,' ... (and so on) ... or 'the Tathāgata neither exists nor does not exist after death.' But the ascetic Gotama teaches a path that is real, true, and actual, a state of the Dhamma, a law of the Dhamma. When he teaches a path that is real, true, and actual, a state of the Dhamma, a law of the Dhamma, how could an intelligent person like me not approve of the well-spoken words of the ascetic Gotama as well-spoken?' 423. "All these wanderers, Poṭṭhapāda, are blind, without eyes; you alone among them have eyes. Indeed, Poṭṭṭhapāda, some doctrines have been taught and declared by me as categorical; and indeed, Poṭṭhapāda, some doctrines have been taught and declared by me as non-categorical. "And what, Poṭṭhapāda, are the non-categorical doctrines taught and declared by me? 'The world is eternal,' Poṭṭhapāda, is a non-categorical doctrine taught and declared by me; 'The world is not eternal,' Poṭṭhapāda, is a non-categorical doctrine taught and declared by me; 'The world is finite,' Poṭṭhapāda, is a non-categorical doctrine taught and declared by me; 'The world is infinite,' Poṭṭhapāda, is a non-categorical doctrine taught and declared by me. ... 'The soul is the same as the body,' Potthapada, 'The soul is one thing, the body another,' Potthapada, 'The Tathāgata exists after death,' Potthapada, 'The Tathāgata does not exist after death,' Potthapada, 'The Tathāgata both exists and does not exist after death,' Potthapada, 'The Tathāgata neither exists nor does not exist after death,' Potthapada, these are doctrines declared by me as undetermined. And why, Potthapada, have these doctrines been declared by me as undetermined? These, Potthapada, are not connected with the goal, not connected with the Dhamma, not fundamental to the holy life, do not lead to disenchantment, to dispassion, to cessation, to tranquility, to direct knowledge, to full enlightenment, to Nibbana. Therefore, these doctrines have been declared by me as undetermined. Determined Doctrine And what are these doctrines, Potthapada, declared by me as determined? 'This is suffering,' Potthapada, this determined doctrine has been declared by me. 'This is the origin of suffering,' Potthapada, this determined doctrine has been declared by me. 'This is the cessation of suffering,' Potthapada, this determined doctrine has been declared by me. 'This is the path leading to the cessation of suffering,' Potthapada, this determined doctrine has been declared by me. And why, Potthapada, have these doctrines been declared by me as determined? These, Potthapada, are connected with the goal, connected with the Dhamma, fundamental to the holy life, they lead to disenchantment, to dispassion, to cessation, to tranquility, to direct knowledge, to full enlightenment, to Nibbana. Therefore, these doctrines have been declared by me as determined. There are, Potthapada, some recluses and brahmins who speak thus, who hold such views: 'The self is absolutely happy and free from illness after death.' I approach them and say: 'Is it true, venerable sirs, that you speak thus, that you hold such views: "The self is absolutely happy and free from illness after death"?' If they, when questioned by me thus... they acknowledge, 'Yes.' Then I say to them: 'Venerable sirs, do you live knowing and seeing a world of unalloyed happiness?' Being asked thus, they say, 'No.' Then I say to them: 'Venerable sirs, do you perceive yourselves to be unalloyedly happy for one night or one day, or for half a night or half a day?' Being asked thus, they say, 'No.' Then I say to them: 'Venerable sirs, do you know: "This is the path, this is the practice for the realization of a world of unalloyed happiness"?' Being asked thus, they say, 'No.' Then I say to them: 'Venerable sirs, do you hear the sound of those deities who have been reborn in a world of unalloyed happiness, speaking thus: "You have practiced well, sirs, you have practiced rightly, sirs, for the realization of a world of unalloyed happiness; for we too, sirs, having practiced thus, have been reborn in a world of unalloyed happiness"?' Being asked thus, they say, 'No.' 'What do you think, Poṭṭhapāda? Is it not the case that, this being so, the speech of those ascetics and brahmins turns out to be without a basis?' 'Indeed, venerable sir, this being so, the speech of those ascetics and brahmins turns out to be without a basis.' 426. 'Just as, Poṭṭhapāda, a man might say: "I desire, I long for the most beautiful woman in this country." They would say to him: "Good sir, the most beautiful woman you desire and long for, do you know if she is a khattiyā, or a brāhmaṇī, or a vessī, or a suddī?" Being asked thus, he would say, 'No.' They would say to him: "Good sir, the most beautiful woman you desire and long for, do you know if she is named thus, or of such a clan, or tall, or short, or medium, or dark, or dusky, or of a golden complexion, or in such and such a village, or town, or city?" Being asked thus, 'No,' he would say. Then they would say to him: 'Good sir, that which you do not know, that which you do not see, that you desire, that you seek?' Being asked thus, he would say: 'Yes.' "What do you think, Poṭṭhapāda? Isn't it true that in this case, the man's statement is without a basis?" "Indeed, venerable sir, in this case, the man's statement is without a basis." "Just so, Poṭṭhapāda, those ascetics and brahmins who hold such views, who hold such doctrines: 'The self is entirely happy, free from illness, after death.' I approach them and say: 'Is it true, venerable sirs, that you hold such views, that you hold such doctrines: "The self is entirely happy, free from illness, after death"?' If, being asked thus, they acknowledge: 'Yes,' then I say to them: 'But do you, venerable sirs, dwell knowing and seeing a world of unalloyed happiness?' Being asked thus, they say: 'No.' "Then I say to them: 'But do you, venerable sirs, for one night, or one day, or half a night, or half a day, perceive yourselves as entirely happy?' Being asked thus, they say: 'No.' Then I say to them: 'But do you, venerable sirs, know: "This is the path, this is the practice, for the realization of a world of unalloyed happiness"?' Being asked thus, they say: 'No.' "Then I say to them: 'But do you, venerable sirs, hear the sound of those deities who have been reborn in a world of unalloyed happiness, as they speak: "You have practiced well, sirs, you have practiced rightly, sirs, for the realization of a world of unalloyed happiness; for we too, sirs, having practiced thus, have been reborn in a world of unalloyed happiness"?' Being asked thus, they say: 'No.' "What do you think, Poṭṭhapāda? Isn't it true that in this case, the statement of those ascetics and brahmins is without a basis?" "Indeed, venerable sir, in this case, the statement of those ascetics and brahmins is without a basis." his speech is accomplished." 427. "Just as, Poṭṭhapāda, a man might build a ladder at a crossroads to ascend a palace. Then they might say to him: 'Good sir, the palace you are building a ladder to ascend, do you know that palace is in the eastern direction, or the southern direction, or the western direction, or the northern direction? Is it high, or low, or medium?' Being asked thus, he would say: 'No.' Then they might say to him: 'Good sir, you are building a ladder to ascend a palace that you do not know, do not see?' Being asked thus, he would say: 'Yes.' "What do you think, Poṭṭhapāda, would not the speech of that man, in that case, be an unmiraculous utterance?" "Indeed, venerable sir, in that case, the speech of that man would be an unmiraculous utterance." "Even so, Poṭṭhapāda, those ascetics and brahmins who hold such views, who speak thus: 'The self is entirely happy, free from illness after death.' I approach them and say: 'Is it true, venerable sirs, that you hold such views, speak thus: "The self is entirely happy, free from illness after death"?' If, being asked thus, they affirm: 'Yes.' Then I say to them: 'But do you, venerable sirs, dwell knowing and seeing a world of unalloyed happiness?' Being asked thus, they say: 'No.' "Then I say to them: 'But do you, venerable sirs, perceive yourselves as entirely happy for one night, or one day, or half a night, or half a day?' Being asked thus, they say: 'No.' Then I say to them: 'But do you, venerable sirs, know: "This is the path, this is the practice for the realization of a world of unalloyed happiness"?' Being asked thus, they say: 'No.' "Then I say to them: 'But do you, venerable sirs, hear the voices of those deities who have been reborn into a world of unalloyed happiness, speaking to each other, Listen to the saying: 'You are well-practiced, sirs, You are rightly practiced, sirs, For the realization of a world of absolute happiness; For we too, sirs, having practiced thus, Have attained a world of absolute happiness'?" When asked thus, they say 'no'. "What do you think, Poṭṭhapāda, Isn't it so that in this case, The statement of those recluses and brahmins