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Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha's son is unable to approach the Blessed One again with the intention of debate. When this was said, Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha's son said to Dummukha the Licchavi's son: "Wait, Dummukha, wait, Dummukha, we are not discussing with you; here we are discussing with Master Gotama." "This statement, Master Gotama, is ours and that of other various ascetics and brahmins. I think it is a lament, a wailing. To what extent, then, is Master Gotama's disciple obedient to the teaching, responsive to advice, with doubts cut off, with perplexity gone, attained to confidence, independent of others, dwelling in the Teacher's dispensation?" "Here, Aggivessana, my disciple whatever form, past, future, or present, internal or external, gross or subtle, inferior or superior, far or near, all form: 'This is not mine, this I am not, this is not my self'— thus he sees this as it really is with right wisdom. Whatever feeling... whatever perception... whatever volitional formations... whatever consciousness, past, future, or present, internal or external... or gross, or subtle, or inferior, or excellent, whether far or near, all consciousness: ‘This is not mine, this I am not, this is not my self’— thus he sees this as it actually is with right wisdom. To this extent, Aggivessana, my disciple is obedient to the teaching, responsive to advice, has crossed over doubt, is free from perplexity, has attained confidence, and lives independent of others in the Teacher’s Dispensation.” “But to what extent, good Gotama, is a bhikkhu an Arahant, one whose taints are destroyed, who has lived the holy life, done what had to be done, laid down the burden, attained his own goal, destroyed the fetters of existence, and is rightly liberated through final knowledge?” “Here, Aggivessana, whatever form there is— past, future, or present, internal or external, gross or subtle, inferior or excellent, whether far or near— all form: ‘This is not mine, this I am not, this is not my self’— having seen this as it actually is with right wisdom, he is liberated by not clinging; whatever feeling there is… whatever perception there is… whatever volitional formations there are… whatever consciousness there is— past, future, or present, internal or external, gross or subtle, inferior or excellent, whether far or near— all consciousness: ‘This is not mine, this I am not, this is not my self’— having seen this as it actually is with right wisdom, he is liberated by not clinging. To this extent, Aggivessana, a bhikkhu is an Arahant, one whose taints are destroyed, who has lived the holy life, done what had to be done, laid down the burden, attained his own goal, destroyed the fetters of existence, and is rightly liberated through final knowledge. A bhikkhu whose mind is thus liberated, Aggivessana, is endowed with three unsurpassed things: the unsurpassed vision, the unsurpassed practice, the unsurpassed liberation. A bhikkhu whose mind is thus liberated, Aggivessana, honors, respects, esteems, and reveres the Tathāgata himself: ‘That Blessed One is enlightened, he teaches the Dhamma for enlightenment; that Blessed One is tamed, he teaches the Dhamma for taming; that Blessed One is peaceful, he teaches the Dhamma for peace; he, that Blessed One has crossed over, he teaches the Dhamma for crossing over; that Blessed One is fully extinguished, he teaches the Dhamma for full extinguishment." 362. When this was said, Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha's son said to the Blessed One: "We ourselves, good Gotama, are destructive, we are presumptuous, in that we thought that good Gotama could be assailed in debate. It might be, good Gotama, that a man could find safety by assailing a rutting elephant, but not by assailing good Gotama could a man find safety. It might be, good Gotama, that a man could find safety by assailing a blazing mass of fire, but not by assailing good Gotama could a man find safety. It might be, good Gotama, that a man could find safety by assailing a venomous, highly poisonous snake, but not by assailing good Gotama could a man find safety. We ourselves, good Gotama, are destructive, we are presumptuous, in that we thought that good Gotama could be assailed in debate. May good Gotama accept a meal from me for tomorrow, together with the community of bhikkhus." The Blessed One accepted by silence. 363. Then Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha's son, knowing the Blessed One's acceptance, addressed those Licchavis: "May the venerable Licchavis listen to me, the ascetic Gotama has been invited by me for tomorrow, together with the community of bhikkhus. Therefore, you should bring to me whatever you deem suitable for him." Then, after the passing of that night, those Licchavis brought to Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha's son five hundred measures of rice-porridge as a meal offering. Then the Nigaṇṭha's son, having prepared exquisite hard and soft food in his own park, had the time announced to the Blessed One: "It is time, good Gotama, the meal is ready." Then the Blessed One, in the forenoon, having dressed, and taking his bowl and robe, went to Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha's son's park; having gone there, he sat down on the seats prepared. He sat down with the community of bhikkhus. Then Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha with excellent hard food and soft food satisfied and served with his own hands the community of bhikkhus headed by the Buddha. Then Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha, when the Blessed One had eaten, and had removed his hand from the bowl, took a certain low seat and sat down to one side. Seated to one side, Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha said this to the Blessed One: "Whatever merit and great merit there is in this gift, good Gotama, may it be for the happiness of the givers." "Indeed, Aggivessana, when one gives to such a recipient who is not free from lust, not free from hatred, not free from delusion, that will be for the givers. Indeed, Aggivessana, when one gives to such a recipient as I am, who is free from lust, free from hatred, free from delusion, that will be for you." The Lesser Discourse to Saccaka, the fifth, is ended. 6. The Greater Discourse to Saccaka 364. Thus have I heard: On one occasion the Blessed One was dwelling in Vesālī, in the Great Wood, in the Gabled Hall. Now at that time the Blessed One, in the morning, having dressed, and taking his bowl and robe, was desirous of entering Vesālī for alms. Then Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha, while walking for exercise, approached the Gabled Hall in the Great Wood. The venerable Ānanda saw Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha coming from afar. Having seen him, he said to the Blessed One: "Here, venerable sir, comes Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha, a debater, one who claims to be wise, well-regarded by many people. Indeed, venerable sir, he desires to disparage the Buddha, he desires to disparage the Dhamma, he desires to disparage the Saṅgha. It would be good, venerable sir, if the Blessed One would sit down for a moment, out of compassion." The Blessed One sat down on the seat prepared. Then Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha approached the Blessed One; having approached, he exchanged greetings with the Blessed One, and after an amiable talk Having finished the friendly talk, he sat down to one side. Seated to one side, Saccaka the Nigaṇṭha's son, said this to the Blessed One: "There are, good Gotama, some recluses and brahmins who live devoted to the development of the body, not to the development of the mind. Indeed, they experience, good Gotama, painful bodily feelings. Formerly, good Gotama, when afflicted by painful bodily feelings, their thighs might become stiff, their heart might burst, hot blood might gush from their mouth, they might fall into madness, into distraction of mind. Indeed, good Gotama, their mind is dependent on the body, it functions according to the body. Why is that? Because the mind is undeveloped. But there are, good Gotama, some recluses and brahmins who live devoted to the development of the mind, not to the development of the body. Indeed, they experience, good Gotama, painful mental feelings. Formerly, good Gotama, when afflicted by painful mental feelings, their thighs might become stiff, their heart might burst, hot blood might gush from their mouth, they might fall into madness, into distraction of mind. Indeed, good Gotama, their body is dependent on the mind, it functions according to the mind. Why is that? Because the body is undeveloped. Therefore, good Gotama, it occurs to me thus: 'Surely the disciples of Master Gotama live devoted to the development of the mind, not to the development of the body.'" "But Aggivessana, what have you heard about the development of the body?" "For example— Nanda Vaccha, Kisa Saṅkicca, Makkhali Gosāla— these, good Gotama, are naked, of loose conduct, licking their hands, they do not accept 'Come, good sir,' nor 'Stay, good sir,' they do not accept food brought specifically for them, nor specially prepared, nor by invitation. They do not accept from the mouth of a pot, nor from the mouth of a bowl, nor from a threshold... Not between posts, not between sticks, not between pestles, not between two people eating, not from a pregnant woman, not from a nursing woman, not from a man who has gone between, not in a crowd, not where a dog is standing, not where flies are swarming. No fish, no meat, no liquor, no intoxicant, no rice-gruel they drink. They are one-house-goers, one-mouthful-eaters; or two-house-goers, two-mouthful-eaters; up to seven-house-goers, seven-mouthful-eaters. They sustain themselves even with one donation; with two donations; up to seven donations. They take food even for one day; for two days; up to seven days. Thus, they dwell devoted to such a practice of eating food by turns, even for half a month. "But Aggivessana, do they sustain themselves with just that?" "No indeed, good Gotama. Sometimes, good Gotama, they eat excellent solid food, they consume excellent soft food, they taste excellent savories, they drink excellent drinks. They, as it were, give strength to this body,